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Author Topic: Divination  (Read 624 times)

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Divination
« on: April 20, 2017, 02:38:07 am »
Em Hotep everyone! :)

I apologize in advance if a thread about divination already exists or if I put it in the wrong section..

So umm I wonder if the ancient egyptians had any ways of predicting the future events somehow. Right now I try to focus on the weather and clairvoyance to predict what kind of period in life is going to come soon. Still have some work to do, as always.

Any ideas?

Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Sedjfaiemitui

  • Shemsu
  • Country: 00
Re: Divination
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2017, 03:22:27 am »
Em hotep nefer, Gleb!

Ancient Egyptians employed a number of the same divinatory methods as neighboring Mesopotamian peoples did, such as interpreting omens from celestial phenomena, and oracular dream incubation. None of these things were / are so much a means of "predicting the future" as they were / are "if P, then Q" conditional possibilities the future may have held for the person(s) involved. Like most Mesopotamian cultures, Ancient Egyptian culture(s) didn't perceive fate as a fixed and inexorable end, nor the actions and possibilities of all mankind predetermined by the positions of the stars in the Heavens and so on. Fate was considered alterable to some degree, dependent upon human understanding and human action, and of course the beneficence of [God].

I hope this helps!

Senebty,
Sedjfai
Sat Set her Amun-Re-Banebdjedet
Meryt Wesir-Herishef her Heru-Wer

"Do not be weary of calling to [God]. He has His hour for listening to the scribe."
- Instructions of Ankhsheshonqy

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Divination
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2017, 09:41:22 am »
Thanks, Sedj! ^_^ Well yeah... I read somewhere that details can be changed even if the bigger picture doesn't change much. Don't know how true it is though. Thanks for your input ^_^
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline napperdapper

  • Remetj
  • Country: gb
Re: Divination
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2017, 05:06:15 pm »
The Demotic Papyri also contain a large amount of Vessel Divination, (Usually Hydromancy.) I'm not sure if this appears in earlier texts though? I think the origins of the Vessel Divination hasn't yet been determined (IE: Is it Egyptian in origin or foreign?)

These "Vessel Divination" rituals are certainly very influential, even appearing under the same structure in later texts like the Magical Treatise of Solomon, a Byzantine magical text and one of the first "Grimoires." They continue to be utilised in the Grimoires and in Western folk magic for a long time after, even up to today.

For resources relating to Vessel Divination, there is "Rituals of Apparition in the Theban Magical Library" by Korshi Dosoo. It is apparently a good read though I havn't got around to reading it properly myself yet. But it should provide plenty of information if you want an academic look at the practice and its context.

 https://www.academia.edu/15681152/Rituals_of_Apparition_in_the_Theban_Magical_Library



Then For the Demotic Magical Papyri, that includes the source of the Vessel Divinations
"The Greek Magical Papyri in Translation, By Hans Dieter Betz" is the way to go.


If you are interested in how similar techniques carried on into western traditions and practices, then I'd be happy to dig up some examples for you.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2017, 03:41:04 am by napperdapper »
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Offline Salqu

  • Country: nz
Re: Divination
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2017, 01:46:51 am »
Don't quote me on this, I'm probably wrong, but I believe Tarot cards originated in Ancient Khem? I'm not sure. If you ask me Tarot readings these days are just a particularly occult way of giving and recieving advice.
If you want to see the future, your best bet is to try to dream divination. There are three ways to do this.
Either you're born with the gift and it occurs for you naturally,
You ask the Gods to show you what you are allowed to see about the future events in question,
Or you can try lucid dreaming, and coercing yourself into a clairvoyant state from within a dream and will yourself to the point in time you are trying to see, but it may not work if you don't have the gift. Good luck :)

Offline Shezatwepwawet

  • Moderator (Kemetic Orthodox Q&A)
  • Moderator
  • *****
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2017, 09:31:49 am »
Em hotep Salqu,

There is no evidence that Tarot emerged in Kemet. Its earliest recorded history is around the 1500s CE, as I recall, so only about 500 years old at most.
Senebty,
Zat (She who makes Sekhmet laugh)

Sat Wepwawet-Yinepu her Hekatawy Alexandros (AUS) meryt Seshat-Nit-Nebthet her Heru-wer

Offline Ra'awyserqet

  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2017, 11:11:47 am »
Em hotep Salqu,

There is no evidence that Tarot emerged in Kemet. Its earliest recorded history is around the 1500s CE, as I recall, so only about 500 years old at most.
Em hotep

I once read a book on the history of the tarot that stated this origin in Egypt was started around when the Golden Dawn and similar were getting their starts. Egypt, as the well renowned place where magic lies, gave a perfect place as an origin. It's actual origins (as purported by the book) started within Europe as a card game that eventually gained a system of divination.

Senebty
Ra'awy

Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk

(They/them)

Sat Serqet-Aset her Nisut-bity Hekatawy | (aus), meryt Sekhmet-Mut, Yinepu-Wepwawet, Heru-wer, her Hethert-Nut-as-Nehmet-Awai.

Child of Serqet-Aset and King Hekatawy | (life prosperity health), Beloved of Sekhmet-Mut, Yinepu-Wepwawet, Heru-wer, and Hethert-Nut-as-Nehmet-Awai.

Offline Salqu

  • Country: nz
Re: Divination
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2017, 05:07:53 pm »
Ah I see, that's interesting. I'm not surprised I might have heard that from something about the golden dawn. They are so full of BS it's really just annoying though there are a lot of gems in there if you know how to pick them out of the BS

Offline Rayashi

  • W'ab Priest - Lay Clergy
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2017, 06:17:07 pm »
Ah I see, that's interesting. I'm not surprised I might have heard that from something about the golden dawn. They are so full of BS it's really just annoying though there are a lot of gems in there if you know how to pick them out of the BS
Em hotep Salqu,

We are a diverse group who practice a variety of magical traditions, in addition to our home of Kemetic Orthodoxy.  I'd like to politely encourage we stay away from putting down or discrediting any magical or religious system.  I look at it as I don't want someone coming here calling KO "BS", so it's best to treat other practices and orders with a similar respect.

Senebty,
Yashi
Rayashi (Yashi) - "Ra calls me"
Sat Ra her Hekatawy Alexandros (AUS)
Meryt Heru-sa-Aset, Wepwawet-Yinepu, Nut, Sekhmet-Hethert, Sokar-Wesir, her Min

Etsy

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Divination
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2017, 01:09:25 pm »
Holy.. I neglected the thread a bit. Ok. Hmmmm.. I don't know about Tarot cards, never looked into them. They scare me.
From what I know, gems are taken out of the water and rocks. But how to use them...
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Riley.rifle

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2017, 02:44:57 pm »
Em hotep Gleb,

May I ask why tarot cards scare you?

While its not ancient, I'm currently working on making a Kemetic themed oracle deck. It's beginning to look like I'll be having them printed up and the whole nine yards. Anyway, sorry to derail your thread.

Senebty,
Leaha
🙌☀
Dua Ra!
Dua Netjer!
~_^

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Divination
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2017, 11:37:00 pm »
Em Hotep, Riley,

Mostly because I never know what to expect and how to use them. Plus the themes confuse me quite a lot.
It's ok, the thread is about divination so any input is welcome. ^_^
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Sopedheru

  • Shemsu
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2017, 02:08:12 am »
Em Hotep, Riley,

Mostly because I never know what to expect and how to use them. Plus the themes confuse me quite a lot.
It's ok, the thread is about divination so any input is welcome. ^_^

Em hotep Gleb :)

Tarot cards can have many themes in one deck even.. they are just focal points to draw emotion, images, sensations from to interpret. :)  There is a lot of symbolism in the cards, and if you understand that particular decks symbolism then that makes it easier to interpret in the context of the energy from the person you're reading them for.   

Here's an easy way to get to know a deck (I used to tell my students who were learning to read the tarot to first throw away the book that comes with them):

1.  Go through the deck and pick out the card that you feel most uncomfortable with, even to the point of actual hate, disregarding the names of the cards. Just go by how the cards make you feel.   Set it aside.

2.  Go through the deck a second time and pick the card that you're most drawn to for whatever reason.  When you find it, set that one aside.

3.  Go through the deck one last time and find the card that best represents visually where you'd like to be in your life right this moment    Set it aside.

Now that you have 3 cards, set them all out in front of you.   For each card, ask yourself why that particular card makes you feel the way you feel when you look at it.  What does it mean to YOU?  Then write it down or remember it.   When you have all 3, you've just read tarot cards  :)   

For example lets say I picked for the card I hate:  10 of swords because it brings up feelings of loneliness  and sadness.  In one word, despair.

The second card being the one I loved the most:  9 of cups because it makes me feel happy and hopeful.

The 3rd card being where I want to be in my life right now:  4 of wands because the picture looks happy and successful.  The couple in the picture have a good home and a stable life.  So, the keywords would be happiness, stability, wealth and success.

Now you put it into a sentence.  There are many ways to interpret this... one way may be that you want to be happy and successful, but your feelings of despair and hopelessness are keeping your from having what you want in life.   or something similar. 

There's a lot more to the symbolism in the cards than that.. but it's a good start to getting to know the cards and getting comfortable with them.  :)   Meditation with each card is also a great way to do that :)   

@Leaha -  That's awesome that you're creating an oracle deck! :D  I Can't wait to see it when it's finished! :D

Senebty,
Soped :)
Sopedheru - Heru is skilled

Sa Heru-Wer
Mery Set her Khnum

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Divination
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2017, 12:57:18 pm »
Thank you, Sopedheru. I think my  fear comes from lack of experience and not knowing what I'll get but thank you so much for explaining the whole thing. ^_^
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Ineqaset

  • Shemsu
  • Country: us
Re: Divination
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2017, 03:09:41 pm »
I've used Tarot for a variety of times in my life.  I even did a short three-card spread before my RPD.  Another divination tool that I've used is the I Ching.  It requires the user to toss three coins or sticks. I've used both and like the coins better - I have three English pounds that I use.  The heads and tails are translated into either a solid or dashed line.  The lines then create a 6-line hexagram.  The user looks up the hexagram in the book to find its meaning.  The I Ching requires me to meditate on the meaning and how it can apply to my life situation.

There are many sites that go through the I Ching if you're interested.

Ineqaset (Aset unites, Aset gathers)
daughter of Aset-Serqet
beloved of Djehuty and Bes

 


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