The House of Netjer, a Kemetic Orthodox Temple

[PUBLIC] About the Kemetic Orthodox Religion => [PUBLIC] Kemetic Orthodox Q&A => Topic started by: Gleb on February 25, 2015, 09:12:57 am

Title: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 25, 2015, 09:12:57 am
Em Hotep *henu*

So I just encountered this article: http://www.egyptpast.com/gods/afterlife.html
It says that if a person wasn't mummified, s/he wouldn't reach the Iaru... And to be fair, it freaks me out...O_O
I know people don't usually get to be mummified these days, unless they pay the right people...

What do you think?

Senebty,
Gleb
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Neferkara on February 25, 2015, 10:50:16 am
Em Hotep

That is most likely what the Ancient Egyptians believed to a certain extent, but their religion evolved and changed throughout the kingdoms.

I wouldn't say I agree, that it is the only way to reach the afterlife, but this is my personal opinion.

My grandmother passed a while ago and her body was cremated. This was the first death of a family member I have experienced and I waited for her to make an appearance, it was at least two months before I made contact with her in the afterlife. during that time I started to think that she didn't make it through the Duat. When she spoke to me she told me she had being busy, that all her time couldn't dedicated to the living anymore.

I have no fear, I see the preservation of the body as a precaution for if it takes longer than normal to travel through the Duat. 

Senebty
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Zaituwy on February 25, 2015, 11:10:36 am
Em Hotep,
I will let you know what I do.  I thought about it and came up with a resolution as long as through my life I read the Book of the Dead and asked Netjer to please forgive my burial practices I will still pass through Duat and make it to the Afterworld. I am sure no one will be reciting the Book of the Dead at my funeral. Netjer loves all his followers and I am sure we will all make it to the Afterworld. Come to think about it I am still new here and I am going to read the Book of the Dead during Senut.  I am sure Netjer will understand.
Senebty,
ThothEvo
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 25, 2015, 12:05:09 pm
Thank you, both!
ThothEvo, I would like to ask you something. If that's ok of course. Is there any tradition of reading the Book of the Dead? Or do you do it for yourself?
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Temseniaset on February 25, 2015, 12:49:06 pm
Em Hotep:

The Book of the Dead was read by a priest and buried with the mummy, if not painted or carved into the tomb of coffin, depending of the Kingdom.  If fact there are a number of them out there, for those with the money had their own BoD written by a priest.

Sandra
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Ha'autmuti on February 25, 2015, 12:52:34 pm
That article is speaking very generally, I think. The common people usually were not mummified in antiquity, as it was expensive and time-consuming, and there is certainly evidence that they believed their ancestors had entered the afterlife just the same. Mummification was just one of many ways to facilitate the soul's survival in the Unseen world. Other methods included images of yourself and the remembrance of your name, which is why many of us keep a list of our Akhu and regularly read off the names.

I find that, the more you learn about ANY subject, the more time you have to spend unlearning all the things you thought you knew, because it's really more complicated than that. Very general articles like this one are fine for beginners, but they omit a lot of information out of necessity--they're trying to serve as an introduction, not the be-all-end-all.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Zaituwy on February 25, 2015, 09:35:58 pm
Exactly what Phoenix said.  I just feel comfort and believe more in the Afterworld when I read the Book of the Dead. It was a resolution for my thoughts before KO.  The tradition part of reading the Book of the Dead was when something died that I loved.  I had two fish die and I did a ceremony for them.  It was beautiful and I felt my pet fish made it to the Afterworld.  I did it to the best of my knowledge I even made a sarcophagus for the fish.  I don't remember it all but I remember having to wait the entire night so Yinepu could take them to the After world and when Ra rises they are there.  It is awesome to do and feel the feeling of the entire process of life and death. The funeral lasts all day all night to the rising of Ra the next morning.  I even had a vision that they were swimming in a divine pool in the Afterworld.  The book is outstanding admiration to Netjer and the belief of life after death.  What other religion do you have Pharaohs or Gods preparing for there entire life to take the journey to the Afterworld in my eyes that takes a great amount of faith in the Afterworld.  That is why the Book of the Dead is so powerful to me because it was used during all the funerals of Pharaohs the ultimate book of faith in the Afterworld.   Maybe I can write it in my will to be done at the funeral. LOL
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Rayashi on February 26, 2015, 12:56:06 am
Just going to leave this here.

www.summum.org
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Bestekeni on February 26, 2015, 01:01:17 pm
A lot of these fears and misunderstandings about what's needed to have an afterlife are misconceptions based on skewed sample size.  Popular press books and television documentaries on ancient Egypt focus on the most elite burials.  The countless typical burials, where unmummified people are found with pottery and maybe some beads, aren't considered flashy and interesting enough for a non-specialist audience. 

Additionally, while burial was imporant, it wasn't the main focus of life.  We just happen to have more funerary stuff than typical everyday stuff because it's underground and sealed. 
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Qebehusenu on February 26, 2015, 01:29:32 pm
I was just thinking about this last night, thanks for opening up the discussion Gleb! :)
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Qebehusenu on February 26, 2015, 01:31:01 pm
Just going to leave this here.

www.summum.org

$67,000 USD + ... whelp I think I'll need to raise my life insurance for that or maybe get a Kickstarter going... lol
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 26, 2015, 02:46:07 pm
Yeah, that thing is pretty pricey. I try to save money for my visit to Kansas before army, once I finish high school. Then - I'll start saving money for this.

Bestekeni - alright. But, what is it worth if the person isn't mummified?
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Bestekeni on February 26, 2015, 10:35:17 pm
What do you mean?  Mummification is not a requirement for an afterlife.  End of story.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Ra'awyserqet on February 26, 2015, 11:22:28 pm
Em hotep!

I plan to be cremated. I have a few reasons for doing so; not taking up space with a dead body, an outfit I'll never wear, and an overly expensive coffin that I'll never use, in a burial plot I'll have to pay off...alongside it's more cost effective, and it means my guy will be able to scatter my ashes in water as I desire. 

I have had no issues coming to this faith and knowing that this is my desire. However, when I came to this faith I was already keeping my dead folks alive (two of which are cremated) through a personal ancestor shrine I had made years earlier when my Granny and then Dad died. I've never had issues speaking to them before I came to this faith and since being a part of this faith I have gotten better at speaking with my older Akhu.

It doesn't necessarily matter if one's body remains whole; there were frequent times when a body's wholeness could simply not be assured. However, through the person's name, image, and/or children/lineage, they would live on. Remembering your Akhu, even when you don't have a picture of them, is the biggest thing in my opinion. Speaking their name, thinking about them, doing something that reminds you of them, etc, all of it feeds their kau.

But that's just me and my experience. :) Your miles may vary.

Senebty,
Ra'awy
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 27, 2015, 11:09:15 am
What do you mean?  Mummification is not a requirement for an afterlife.  End of story.
Oh yeah? Cool! :)
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 27, 2015, 11:10:22 am
Thank you all for your input! ^__^
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Zaituwy on February 27, 2015, 10:29:44 pm
ROFL pretty pricey yup!  How about being buried with the Book of Dead.  Totally understand all the comments but I sill would love to be mummified.  I can still bring my statues with me in my coffin that would be like Pharaohs.  They are our human gods not to be pessimistic but I would like to emulate them in the best way possible.  I guess just like our ancient siblings of our faith burial practices would be ok in modern times.  I just don't know about cremation it sounds to much like India but if you want to Netjer would understand. Follow human Gods lead the Pharaohs back when our gods ruled the Earth long live the Pharaohs of Earth. Our gods had PHD's, lavish taste, and gave us the prime example of believing in the Afterworld long live the Pharaohs of Earth again. Nekhtet Netjer!!!:-) Love you big Divinity for giving us the sons and daughters of Rah and you. Kings and Queens.  Thanks for all the comments I feel very Afterworldish as of now.  I can't wait to see what the Pharaohs and priest have prepared for us it has to be so epic since they are the center of everything we have today. Plus they are the center of everything in the Future it has to so awesome in the Afterworld.  Thanks again everyone you guys gave me a Kemetic faith boost. Love my KO siblings.
Senebty,
ThothEvo
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Bestekeni on February 28, 2015, 12:09:17 am
I'm fairly certain that no ancient nisut was ever awarded a PhD. 
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on February 28, 2015, 05:47:52 am
What's a PHD?
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Ha'autmuti on February 28, 2015, 04:10:18 pm
A doctoral degree; the final, highest academic degree in most fields. It wasn't invented until the middle ages.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Zaituwy on February 28, 2015, 07:52:20 pm
There education level would be translated to a PhD in modern times.  They were the top of their knowledge in their time.  You can't have today without yesterday.  Sorry for the vague translation.
Senebty,
ThothEvo
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Rayashi on February 28, 2015, 09:10:49 pm

I just don't know about cremation it sounds to much like India but if you want to Netjer would understand.

If you or anyone else here has a question about what is really involved with modern funeral practices, please ask. I would even be happy starting a thread for it, if enough people were interested.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Ha'autmuti on February 28, 2015, 10:37:36 pm
I'm actually not sure the pharaohs WERE the top-tier educated. They were educated to run the country, of course, but I don't think they were usually PhD-level in any one field. They didn't need to be.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Gleb on March 01, 2015, 01:18:18 am
Aahhhh I see. Thanks! :)
I decided that whether I will be mummified or not, I'll take my amulets with me. And perhaps the picture of the only human friend I've got. At least for now.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: terrapin46 on March 01, 2015, 09:14:12 am
Mummified fish....I am trying so hard not to think of lox right now. :|

If it helps, I remember reading somewhere on a blog quoting a scholarly paper that the logic behind mummification wasn't so much to preserve the physical body as it was to transform it into an amulet to represent the person.  To that end, I wonder if one of those headstones where you can get a picture/likeness of the person etched onto it could probably do the same thing, for less cost and with less specialty/easier to find locally.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Helmsman_of_Yinepu on March 01, 2015, 09:35:06 am
There will probably be photos of you on the Internet Archive. That should give you worldwide access from the Duat.
Title: Re: Mummification - heeelp!
Post by: Zaituwy on March 01, 2015, 02:15:29 pm
Phoenix you are correct the smartest people were probably the teachers of the Pharaohs.