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Author Topic: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...  (Read 12234 times)

Offline HedebBast

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Offline NiankhSekhmet

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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2010, 07:58:28 pm »
While I remain totally unconvinced that Akhenaten is indeed the father of NebkheperuRa Tutankhamun, I am very pleased to know that I was right in my belief that the Elder Lady is none other than  Queen Tiye .  It is very good to have that confirmation. :)

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by NiankhSekhmet »
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Offline A_Adjensenu

  • Shemsu
Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2010, 09:38:34 am »
Egads, Tutankamun is a grab bag of syndromes and diseases!  Talk about getting the short end of the stick...
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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2010, 04:29:38 am »
This is very interesting, since I have heard rumours that investigation on y-cromosome haplogrups on king Tut proved that his DNA is 99% west european...Does anyone has some more info on that how is this possible?
Isi-senu  
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Offline Bestekeni

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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2010, 07:53:24 am »
That is something I've never seen mentioned in any of the real scientific and academic literature.  Sounds like white supremacist propaganda to me.
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Offline Devo

  • Remetj
Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2010, 08:49:09 am »
It's my understanding that they're changing their minds about the DNA tests all the time. I guess it's not as accurate on ancient mummy's as one would think. Not to mention just deciding on which mummy is who's doesn't seem to help.

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Isi-senu  
"Two are Ancient"

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Offline Sedjemes

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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2010, 09:05:17 am »
Hotep

I read over some of those links about the western European. It is difficult to tell what their information fully is. Mention of an R1b1 hapgroup or whatever can be misleading. There is one of those that is "western European" and one of those that is also from the Chadic group of Africa. I notice those articles quoted don't explain the full science, if any, behind that claim. Oy.

In any event, it sounds all part and parcel of an "agenda." In the time of Tut and the centuries before and the centuries after, people came and went. They did not care about "racial groups" like we seem to today. There was no "white" nor "black." They knew if someone was from the Delta or from Thebes.


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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2010, 04:33:02 am »
Well for me this is not racial issue, but scientific issue. it would be nice that mister Hawass release info imediatelly to stop any kind of misinterpreting of results which already started
Isi-senu  
"Two are Ancient"

Sa Wesir her Nit-Nebthet-Seshat, mery Djehuty her Aset-Serqet

Offline Phoenix_Falls

  • Divined Remetj
Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2010, 10:24:28 am »
That article seems to have some "us vs. them" racial mentality and I tend to shy away from any news-source that can't keep a critical, scientific eye on things like that. It was that last line: "So much for the Afro-centrists and others who have derided the very obvious northwestern European appearance of a large number of the pharonic mummies. It seems like March of the Titans was right after all…" just did it for me and ruined any valid information they might have had in the article. Not to mention that the title of the article is a bold statement as it's never been proven that Tutankhamun was European of all things.

Ancient Egypt is a battle ground for Euro-centrists and Afro-centrists alike and I feel that if science shows anything, it's that they're both wrong and the modern descendants of the AE's are those who are ethnically Coptic (one can be a religious Copt as well).

In the same vein, I don't see why it matters. The AE's didn't care about race. They cared whether or not someone was of Kemet.

Perhaps a better article would be   here from the National Geographic website. Their article establishes:

Amenhotep III as the grandfather
Queen Tiye as the grandmother  
Mummy found in KV35 referred to as   "The Younger Lady"  as the mother (also as daughter of the first two)
Akhenaten as the father

It was assumed that Nefertiti was Tut's mother as she was Akhenaten's principal wife, but the DNA findings show that Tutankhamun's parents were closely related (brother/sister) and Nefertiti wasn't related to Akhenaten. Unless The Younger Lady is found to be 100% European and Akhenaten is found to be at the very least, 90% European, there's no way that Tutankhamun was European. Which is an absurd speculation during the Amarna Period at any rate.
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Offline NiankhSekhmet

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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2010, 10:58:00 am »
I agree that the article is a bit of flame baiting at best.  However, there are quite a number within Egyptology who question Zahi Hawass definitive conclusions  for other reasons as well. Egypt seems to believe it has a very vested interest in making certain that the general laypublic at the very least continues to see Tutankhamun as the "Boy King", when clearly by skeletal evidence, he was closer to mid to late twenties when he died.  That means that he is very probably too old to be the son of Akhenaten. Add to this the fact that Kiya, Tutankhamun's mother, was inherrited along with the rest of the harem by Amenhotep IV (Akhenaten) from his father, Amenhotep III.

I am on the side of demanding to see the conclusive DNA evidence, which Hawass has been either unable or unwilling to provide in order to determine it for certain. Given past behaviours of the Director General of Antiquities, I cannot take his claim on face value alone. I will always assert that the father of Nebkheperura Tutankhamun is the son of Amenhotep III and Kiya and Akhenaten is his elder brother until I am shown adequate and verifiable evidence to the contrary.  What I have seen so far has not convinced me in the slightest.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by NiankhSekhmet »
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Offline Phoenix_Falls

  • Divined Remetj
Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2010, 12:57:02 pm »
I agree that there's no reason to keep the DNA results sealed and that we won't know 100% until they're released to the public. I really doubt the tourism industry would suffer that much if it's found and released that he was indeed in his 20s. The Boy King image has been set for so long, it'll be difficult to change.
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Offline Bestekeni

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Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2010, 04:56:35 pm »
As far as I understand, all the DNA tests suggested was that the mummy BELIEVED TO BE (never proven to be) Akhenaton and Tutankhamun share Y-DNA.  That means they are probably male-line related, but does not prove he is his father.  Could be a cousin, uncle, brother...
Fedw diviner for Bes
𓃀𓎂𓀭𓏏𓎡𓈖𓁐
Sat Bes her Hekatawy Alexandros (AUS)
Meryt Heru-wer her Amun-Ra her Bast

Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2010, 02:42:25 am »
It is interesting to me that no one came to conclusion that maybe it is possible that western europeans are 90% egyptian :) or to make dna analysis on the mummies of supposed Akhenaten and his wife?

@phoenix_falls...in my opinion tourism can even prosper on those kind of misteries :)

@ kai-imakhu Niankh...wasn't Kiya Mitanni? Since Mitanni are some kind of indo-european nation, is it possible that this is why Tutankhamon's DNA is tested european? It is known from history that nobility mixed between each other, so it is also possible that in the time of ancient egyptian kingdom same happened...

@bestekeni...as I have read on hawass' site, "younger lady" is Tutankhamons mother, and sister of Akhenaton...probably one of his younger sisters...and that Akhenaten is definitely the father...dna analysts rather like to make those analysis on males, since females lack the Y-cromosome...I am not expert in dna analysis, it is just interesting to me to find out movement of the ancient people. I am not a centrist of any kind, but I believe that the humans originated in Africa, and from there they inhabited whole Earth. In my personal opinion, Europe was last to become inhabited with us, modern people, after the end of last iceage. A lot of archaeological evidence regarding european neanderthals (even in croatia) prooved that point. But anyway, history is quite shaddy science, and on lot of questions we will never find true answers.
Isi-senu  
"Two are Ancient"

Sa Wesir her Nit-Nebthet-Seshat, mery Djehuty her Aset-Serqet

Offline NiankhSekhmet

  • Shemsu-Ankh
Re: Have DNA tests proved Ankhenaten was Tutankhmun's father...
« Reply #14 on: July 30, 2010, 08:04:54 am »
@Isisenu  I am far less concerned with whether he is Indo European.  Seriously, the Ancient Kemetic people paid far less attention to "race" than what even modern people do.  It is just ridiculous how people on both sides of the issue have acted.  

My main concern is that Hawass and his office not make indisputable proclamations (as far as Hawass is concerned) that are misleading and that they are either unwilling or unable to substantiate. I think it has always been a case of the former rather than the latter given how protectionst Hawass has been for the whole of his career about these things.

@Phoenix_Falls: Nevermind that it seems to us like it would be an unreasonable fear that would cause no serious damage to the tourism industry, there is that fear. If you only knew....*g*

There is no denying that it is fascinating, but they really need to be a bit more forthcoming with the evidence so it can be examined by those with a little less of a vested interest in the results. ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by NiankhSekhmet »
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