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Author Topic: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?  (Read 3467 times)

Offline terrapin46

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« on: September 26, 2013, 07:09:34 am »
The thread on human family has me wondering.

Has anyone ever been divined to have an RPD Parent that their relationship is less than good or pleasant with?

I have always written and enjoyed using language well, at one point as a kid I had some older girls at Girl Scout camp frisk me (jokingly) for a tape recorder because I used big words, lol.

But I would be absolutely horrified if Djehuti came up.  I have occasionally felt persecuted/punished by this Name, whenever I say *anything* that veers even close to the boundaries of human interpersonal ma'at, the universal retribution received I feel has always been/typically is unusually fierce/harsh/brutal, (which for some reason I have pegged as His handywork,) and I have maintained caution and distance regarding this Name much of my adult life.

Has it ever happened that a person was divined with a Parent Name that they have a troubled relationship with, such as one might with human parents?

Not that I'm anywhere near RPD, I haven't even taken the class yet, but theoretically?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2013, 07:11:30 am by thefisherfool »

Offline Bestekeni

  • Semer-Wati
  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2013, 09:36:17 am »
I think a good thing would be to parse out why you have issues with a certain Name, because, in all likelihood, it's not on Their end.

People tend to carry a lot of baggage into KO and it's not a judgment or assignment of blame.  The combination of growing up in a culture with a vengeful god and suddenly coming to terms with the one-and-the-many can lead to people loading their own personal issues onto certain deities.  I did this at first and I bet almost everyone here has had that moment.  

I had a lot of issues with Amun because of my Jewish upbringing.  Long story.  However, I was divined with Amun-Ra as a beloved, and that forced me to work through the baggage I had assigned to that deity.  
Fedw diviner for Bes
𓃀𓎂𓀭𓏏𓎡𓈖𓁐
Sat Bes her Hekatawy Alexandros (AUS)
Meryt Heru-wer her Amun-Ra her Bast

Offline Khenneferitw

  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2013, 10:07:51 am »
It wasn't that Wepwawet and I had a bad relationship at first... it was a distant one.

Wepwawet and I had worked together before. It was with His help that I'd moved through my last term of high school into my first term of college. We hadn't interacted much in the months between then and my RPD, but I was very excited... only to hit a wall.

Sometimes He was around - the nights of Senut between my RPD and my Naming, I felt His proud, but silent presence. Most of the time... nothing. Sometimes I asked Him why He wasn't there. "Busy."

It was a little hard to deal with for me, emotionally speaking. Here was a god who I had worked well with, a god who had chosen me, and not the other way around (other than, well, I chose Him back, in confirming my divination). In time, He was less busy - or at least, He worked me into His schedule, and we started developing our Father-daughter relationship. I still know Him less than my other RPD gods, I still am closer to Them than to Him: but we respect each other, work together more often, and I value Him just as much as all the other gods I am sworn to serve.
Khenne | they/them
Child of Ptah-Sokar, Wepwawet, & (Hekatawy-Alexandros)|
Beloved of Bast, Sekhmet, & Set
Fedw diviner | Sau apprentice | Boston Fellowship Coordinator

Offline Devo

  • Remetj
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2013, 03:44:31 pm »
I'm not divined as a member of KO, but I can say that relationships with NTR can go sour, or go south, and that NTR aren't always the nicest folks around. So even if it hasn't occurred with an RPD person, I can guarantee you its happened in general, in the Kemetic sphere.
I do agree that figuring out why it is that you dislike the deity, or why you don't get along can be enlightening, but it doesn't necessarily mean that that will fix everything. Sometimes, much like with people, gods don't like a particular person (or vice versa) or sometimes things happen btwn a deity and the devotee and there is no fixing hte relationship.
How you'd remedy that or come to terms with that in regards to an RPD, I can't say. But its been a discussion that Kemetics have been having lately, off and on- figuring out what to do if a deity/devotee relationship doesn't pan out.

Not sure if helpful. I knwo that because I don't have an RPD, my experience likely won't count for much, but there it is, all the same.
-Devo
dA | FB | Tumblr | WP

Offline Ma'atnofret

  • Rev. A'aqyt - Ordained Clergy
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2013, 03:50:47 pm »
  I have never received any negative impressions from a Name within my RPD. In my line-up I have felt nothing but love from them. With Nebthet and Yinepu being somewhat distant and silent, but still calm and caring.
  There are some names I have been afraid to connect with (Aset is still intimidating), but nothing threatening or harsh. Not from Netjer. I could see certain names being very strong in opinion or expectations though.

  I have felt something akin to fear, doubt, and harshness when trying to connect with two angels. But in the end I found that it was my fears and doubts within myself that was masking/tainting the perception I had of them. It boiled down to my feelings of insecurity and fear.  
A'Aqytsekhmet "Sekhmet's Servant"
Sat Sekhmet meryt Sobek-Ra, Yinepu, Nebthet, Nefertem, Wenut, Sokar-Wesir
Nekhen Iakhu Ihy Neferu Khau
Fedw Diviner  -  Shrine Image Service available  -  Self-Care Sekhmet Advocate
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Offline Caitlin

  • Remetj
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2013, 04:12:31 pm »
While I have not been divined, I do work very closely with Djehuty. As such, I will be the first to tell you that he can be mean and nasty. Just look at the myth about him and Babi, where Djehuty steals offerings from Ra during the dark moon. When Babi tries to bring Djehuty to justice, Djehuty uses his trickery to get Babi in trouble for it. When his book is taken, he doesn't just kill the guilty party, he kills the man's wife and infant son.

The point is, gods can be mean, and they can be cruel. And sometimes? Sometimes they don't like us and we don't know why. I have seen, first hand, Djehuty showing his darker side to friends of mine. And I have seen how no, it wasn't these people's fault.

Sometimes, gods don't like us, the way we may not always like them. I can assure you there are some gods out there that I strongly dislike. There's some gods I used to hate because of things they've done to me (by the way, they did those things without me ever having approached them, despite the fact that I genuinely liked them before hand).

OP, I am sorry people are telling you it's your fault that Djehuty treats you that way. And I am sorry that Djehuty treats you the way he does. I do know what it feels like to be told those things, and honestly? The way I've dealt with gods that didn't like me doing cruel things to me is I've gone to gods that do like me and I've asked them to help.

Offline terrapin46

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2013, 08:55:16 pm »
So many thoughts.

First of all, I'm not taking anything anyone has said so far badly or the wrong way.  I'm not on or involved in very much of the Neopagan community, for example, because there tends to be this cult of personality there probably originating in the pageantry of mediumship that sometimes comes off as who can be harshest and the hardest nosed "truth teller" that's a bit off-putting.  The whole reason I hang around the House of Netjer  is because I've never gotten anything but balanced and graceful responses from the people here.  So no worries, I don't feel ganged up on in the least.

I am very thankful for such a differing variety of opinions and information, too, though :)  As said, I don't get around the Kemetic or even Pagan landscape much to have a very broad view on things.  It's appreciated!

I also know there are many people here whose most meaningful relationship with god is through this Name, and I'm not saying Djehuti is terrible, I'm sure He is not and that They all have as many wonderful qualities.

I just...have felt vaguely over the years like there's some kind of geas or curse on me policing my speech to particularly exacting ma'at standards and that enacts nearly instant karma & seems to deliver it harshly.  Since Djehuti is the Name associated with both language and karma, or so new age reading has lead me to believe, I can only assume it has something to do with Him.

I'm sure there is a large personal component framing all of this, I do have generalized anxiety disorder so irrational and creeping bouts of doom pertaining to Netjer do most likely stem from myself/brain chemistry.  And I really can mirror Djehuti a lot in some of my less positive traits, so I'm sure that reflection contributes hugely to the negative feelings too.  However it really doesn't help that very frequently when I venture to speak, my butt gets shredded and handed back to me as lo mein in a bizarrely intense and stressful way.  

Are there constructive ways to interpret the phenomenon? Yes. I can say on the surface that none of the ideas being enforced are bad ones.  Do I feel any kind of positivity or warmth coming from the energy behind/directing the backlash giving/teaching them?   No, and that's highly unnerving.  I know not all of Netjer's lessons are easy, I've had some doozies with NebtHet and Sekhmet-Hethert is approaching the gate & can't imagine it'll be all roses, but this issue is different, I have never gotten a sense of any regard.  Asking for the assistance of dieties I'm on better terms with when occasions arise is probably a good tack to take.

And it didn't occur to me until recently to much unease, could and do these personally troubling Nejteru come up in Kemetic Orthodox line-ups?  

Is it possible & has it ever happened that someone ended up obligated to a Name they find a distressing prospect more than anything?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2013, 08:59:03 pm by thefisherfool »

Offline NiankhSekhmet

  • Shemsu-Ankh
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2013, 11:07:58 pm »
Has it ever happened? Yes.  When Sekhmet showed up - before I was divined, She scared the everliving HELL out of me! Amun sort of imperiously showed up just prior to my divination.  For many,. many years, I could not even begin to relate to the other side of Sekhmet, HetHert.  I wanted absolutely no part of Her.  Now it is far better because it finally clicked.  I have also witnessed other Sekhmet siblings who did.not.want. Her and wanted Another Name instead.  That was not esay for them, or anyone else in the vicinity either.

So...does it happen? Yes, sometimes. But you either deal with it or you don't.

Whose "fault" is it?  I am not sure why anyone would tend to view it that way.  I think sometimes relationships, be they between humans or humans and gods can be strained for any number of reasons at times.  Can you go to other deities or the akhu for help in dealing with it?   Possibly. That may be what is necessary in the end and that is alright as well.

Really, who is to say that it will end up for you that way, anyway? Do you think that Djehuty kids are the only ones who have a gift for language and communications or are capable of having a large vocabulary?  I can tell you from experience, Sekhmet is pretty damned exacting when it comes to holding people to their word and to Ma'at.

I honestly think that perhaps you are putting out a great deal of anxiety where it probably doesn't exist.  Your lessons, your interaction with the Divine and the understanding you come to is going to be solely your own. After being here 20 years, I can tell you from experience, no matter what Name(s) of Netjer is your Parent(s) or Beloved(s) that it is a long term process that you will have the time to work through it and others may be able to give you some insights, however, that relationship is going to be as unique as you yourself are.

Worrying about it really doesn't help.

Senebty!

NiankhSekhmet
Sat Sekhmet-Mut/HetHert
Meryt-Amun (Beloved of Amun)
Heri Seshta Sekhmet-Mut / HetHert

Offline terrapin46

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2013, 07:12:31 pm »
This is true.  

I guess it just never occurred to me that it was a possibility to ever happen before.  And the one time in my life I was wanting to know Thoth, as a teenager, a friend and I messing around with books on magic together did a stupid little love spell for my friend for this guy Joe she had a crush on.  A little over-dramatically because we were being sarcastic butts about how crazy it looked with the candles & all, she went all campy dramatic & jokingly said, "I want Joe, if I can't have him no-one can".  Well, like some lame plot out of a horror movie, Joe wrapped his car around a telephone pole & died 4 months later.  It was an extremely unpleasant experience that made a huge impression.  Rationally and realistically speaking, I know young high-school age men aren't the safest drivers in the world statistically and most schools will have lost a teenage driver at some point. And the events of life really are mostly random, it's the mind that shapes it into a pattern of understanding and cause & effect, and that thinking can be unhealthy in a person's mind like I can get.  But some Names work better with a person than others and I would hate to be confronted with one that doesn't when it comes to something as deeply meaningful and personal as RPD, regardless of (and I *don't* doubt it, believe it or not,) of how much Netjer's universe-soul loves us all for our life in it and wants us to live well & to the best of our abilities.

You are right, though.  I'm not likely to even get to the point where RPD becomes a concern anytime soon, I have more than enough to keep me busy for a very long time learning the very basics of an active spirituality.

There's so many threads of people worrying about who wouldn't be in their line-ups, it just seems appropriate to discuss legit fear-fears, too.

EDIT:  I know no one here can figure it out for me on my own path, either.  Saying it helps though, haha.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2013, 07:27:33 pm by thefisherfool »

Offline NiankhSekhmet

  • Shemsu-Ankh
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2013, 12:42:23 am »
Em hotep!

I am very sorry you had to go through such a terrible experience like that. Working magic or spells - or heka as we call it here, is to be viewed as a very serious business. This is why we maintain that words are sacred, and we learn to watch them and not throw them around carelessly. That's a lifelong lesson for some of us. It sound to me like you got the lesson of weighing your words and action with care and precision - and that really is part and parcel of what Ma'at is all about....no matter what Name of Netjer we get in our personal lineup.

If you are anxious, there are plenty of folks to talk those fears and concerns over with.  Certainly your sebau for the class, Hemet and other shemsu and remetj can help. However, as I alluded to in my last response, the beauty of this Faith, I think is that it is so very individual for each person. I think that is completely necessary for our growth and understanding toward ma'at . No doubt you will have your own thoughts on the matter,too. The best thing to do is to just give yourself room and time and when you are afraid or think you have gotten in over your head for whatever reason, there are plenty of us here to talk it over if you want.  

I hope that helps. :)

NiankhSekhmet
Sat Sekhmet-Mut/HetHert
Meryt-Amun (Beloved of Amun)
Heri Seshta Sekhmet-Mut / HetHert

Offline Itenumuti

  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2013, 07:03:17 pm »
There have been a wealth of insights from a variety of angles here, and while I doubt I'd have much to add in terms of viewpoints, I would like to say this: if one chooses to go through the beginner course, and and become a Remetj, and undergo the RPD--none of which are required steps to be a Kemetic and/or interact with Netjer--one is not required to accept the results of the RPD. I don't think it's terribly common to refuse the results, as those who take the RPD tend to have prepared themselves for the possibility of either not having their favorite Name or having their least-favorite Name show up, but it is an option that may help allay some of the anxiety here.

Another point that may help: the Netjeru Who appear in our RPDs care for us. Otherwise, They wouldn't show up. :) So, if a Netjeru in one's RPD was a challenge, the difficulty would more likely be on the person's end and thus able to be worked through for a positive end result, not stemming from an apathy or dislike on the god's part, since the god would have stayed out of the lineup in the first place if They didn't care about the person.

Just a few morsels for thought. :)
Senebty, Tenu
𓇋𓏏𓈖𓏌𓏲𓂉𓏛𓄿𓏭
Child of Nebt-het & Hethert-Nut
Beloved of Ma'ahes, Serqet, & Wepwawet
𓉠𓃕𓄂𓆫𓃧

Offline Sedjemes

  • Semer-Wati
  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2013, 01:14:54 pm »
Em hotep fisher,

It is heartening to see someone giving so much thought to how words and actions may rebound back and forth through all our human interactions.

Many of our gods are associated in some way with speech. Aset, who is my own divine Parent, is Mistress of heka and cleverest in speech of all the gods so one text says. Sekhmet is a deity very much associated with appropriateness of both word but especially of action (sometimes we forget one in favor of the other, silly us).

I have sometimes wondered if, when my own words seem to bring all sorts of negative results that I never planned or anticipated, (won't discuss actions right now, since speech is the trickier of the two for appropriateness) I rarely have ever thought about any god as being the one who kicked me with those results. Instead, I would take a hard objective look back on exactly what I said, how I said it, who I said it to, for what reason, and was it possible that my words could have been taken completely wrong from my own intent? I have found that more often, my intentions (good or not) did not come through my words as much as i hoped they would.

For that lack of clarity, and perhaps, lack of appropriateness of motive if applicable, I could only really blame myself, no deity. Netjer (pick any god thereof) gave me a brain, a heart, a mind, all the qualities and attributes that could and should make me aware of how I might cause offense, pain, heartache, disappointment, anger--as well as any good feelings and thoughts. If I mess up and get into a horrid situation through my words--I spend a great deal of time reviewing just what those words were and the entire situation.

And then I figure out how I could fix that situation. Sometimes I even remember to ask Netjer for, at the least calmness to do the fixing properly.
Khenmetaset ("Aset Gladdens")
Sedjemes ("She listens")
Daughter of Aset-Serqet, Meryt Ra her Sekhmet
Heri-Sesheta Aset-Serqet

Offline Maen

  • Shemsu
  • Country: 00
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2013, 05:42:10 pm »
em hotep

Quote from: thefisherfool

But I would be absolutely horrified if Djehuti came up.  I have occasionally felt persecuted/punished by this Name, whenever I say *anything* that veers even close to the boundaries of human interpersonal ma'at, the universal retribution received I feel has always been/typically is unusually fierce/harsh/brutal, (which for some reason I have pegged as His handywork,)


Djehuti is one of my Beloved, and very important to me, and I have always experienced Him as clear, distant, cool and dignified... with a wicked sense of humor hidden beneath.
Frankly, I'm not so surprised that you are wary of Djehuti and fear His retribution - that's one important aspect of Him, after all.

For example, see the Instruction of Amenemope, Chapter 15:

Do not dip (your) reed against the one who sins.
The beak of the Ibis is the finger of the scribe;
Take care not to disturb it;
The Ape (Thoth) rests (in) the temple of Khmun,
While his eye travels around the Two Lands;
If he sees one who sins with his finger (that is, a false scribe),
he takes away his provisions by the flood.
As for a scribe who sins with his finger,
His son shall not be enrolled.

Translation from http://www.touregypt.net/instructionofamenemope.htm#ixzz2h4r4wwpW (I just had a German translation among my books)

and Chapter 16:
Do not unbalance the scale nor make the weights false,
Nor diminish the fractions of the grain measure;
Do not wish for the grain measures of the fields
And then cast aside those of the treasury.
The Ape sits by the balance,
While his heart is the plummet. (the feather of Ma'at, of course)
Where is a god as great as Thoth
The one who discovered these things, to create them?

Do not get for yourself short weights;
They are plentiful, yea, an army by the might of God.
If you see someone cheating,
At a distance you must pass him by.
Do not be avaricious for copper,
And abjure fine clothes;
What good is one cloaked in fine linen woven as mek,
When he cheats before God.
When gold is heaped upon gold,
At daybreak it turns to lead.

Also from: http://www.touregypt.net/instructionofamenemope.htm#ixzz2h4sW3wfc

It's Djehuti's job to keep a close eye on our actions, especially on to the written and spoken word as well as business, calculations and court dealings.
The thin, long beak of the Ibis is compared to the reed, the writing instrument, but also to the crescent moon - and it's not by chance that the crescent moon is also likened to the knife.

But I do not think that you truly need to fear Him, if you are trying to uphold Ma'at as well as you can. Perhaps it's more a matter of your own expectations: That you strive to be perfect, and fee guilty if you aren't (Just a guess. It's something that I often tend to do). The Gods know you well, inside and out. They know what you can do, and what is beyond your strength. And They will not punish you for failing if your heart was in the right place.


Just my two cents, and Amenemope's two deben

senebty

Ma'en
Ma'a-en-Hethert ("rightly belonging to HetHert")
Daughter of HetHert-Sekhmet, beloved of Nut, Djehuty and Nit-NebtHet-Seshat

Offline Shezep_shuty

  • Country: us
Re: Rocky relationships with RPD Parents?
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2013, 01:51:25 pm »
I've had a difficult time with Ra. Even before I was divined, I put him on my "difficult" list for the questionnaire. He has been pretty harsh with me in the past. Over time, I've gotten to know him better. I'm starting to get an idea of how he operates. He's actually been very beneficial in the past year, and he's taught me a lot. I'm proud to have him at my back now.

One thing I'll point out, is that if a god is being harsh with you, it may be because they have an interest in you. They hold you to a higher standard because they care. A random god on the street might not worry quite so much about how you conduct yourself, but a parent might be quicker to try to correct your mistakes. I don't think it's a sign that he doesn't like you. Quite the opposite! It takes courage and patience to deal with that kind of pressure, but it's worth it in the end.
Kemetic Mystic
Heru-sa-Aset is my copilot.

 


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