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Author Topic: Does Apep have any modern relevance?  (Read 3853 times)

Offline M'aqanitui

  • Shemsu
  • Country: gb
Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« on: December 10, 2014, 08:04:39 am »
Em hotep!

Like the title says, I was wondering if Apep was in any way relevant to modern Kemetism? Aside from just his place in the myths, I mean.
Sat Ra her Wepwawet-Yinepu
Meryt Bast her Djehuty

Never stop smiling, and you will always stay firmly on your feet. :)

Offline Sedjemes

  • Semer-Wati
  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2014, 09:49:37 am »
Hotep Abigail,

Kemetic Orthodoxy does still refer to Apep as an entity. During our religious New Year celebrations in early August (which are referred to as Wep Ronpet), one of the state/community rituals performed then involves the ritual destruction of Apep, going into the coming year.

Apep is not a "god of evil" or a devil, as might be familiar from Christian theology. Apep represents the Uncreated, the negation of creation and of life. it is not death, it is not strictly evil, as an objective force, it is not an end of life. Apep is "not-life" if that makes sense.

Does this make sense?

Senebty
Khenmetaset ("Aset Gladdens")
Sedjemes ("She listens")
Daughter of Aset-Serqet, Meryt Ra her Sekhmet
Heri-Sesheta Aset-Serqet

Offline M'aqanitui

  • Shemsu
  • Country: gb
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2014, 09:56:55 am »
That's a little hard to wrap my head around, but I think I've got the gist. Thanks! :)
Sat Ra her Wepwawet-Yinepu
Meryt Bast her Djehuty

Never stop smiling, and you will always stay firmly on your feet. :)

Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2014, 11:00:51 am »
This is how I understand it:

Let's pretend existence is a two-sided coin, with one side being good, and the other side being evil. Apep is not the evil side, because the evil side is still part of existence. Apep is the complete absence of the coin.
When you break something up, you create things.
When you create something, you destroy things.
Ultimately these concepts connect as one.

Offline M'aqanitui

  • Shemsu
  • Country: gb
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2014, 11:08:17 am »
Is Apep considered to be a conscious being, or just a depiction of a concept?
Sat Ra her Wepwawet-Yinepu
Meryt Bast her Djehuty

Never stop smiling, and you will always stay firmly on your feet. :)

Offline Tatjasobekra

  • Divined Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2014, 03:43:14 pm »
AFAIK, Ap/ep is not a conscious being. It is a driving force. It doesn't have any preference to what it wants to Uncreate, and I doubt it would be a "want" at all. Its entire existence is simply to Uncreate.

This is why when I see people who say they worship the Ap/ep, I know they don't understand what it really is.
Sat Sobek-Ra
Meryt Wadjet, Djehuty, Bast her Aset-Serqet

Mudang (korean shaman-priest) ; God Divination, Kut Ceremony, Prayerwork by appointment.
{ themudang.com | ig@themudang }

Offline M'aqanitui

  • Shemsu
  • Country: gb
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2014, 04:32:52 pm »
Why would anyone worship Apep even if it was a conscious being? They're probably just trying to be edgy.
Sat Ra her Wepwawet-Yinepu
Meryt Bast her Djehuty

Never stop smiling, and you will always stay firmly on your feet. :)

Offline Tasedjebbast

  • Divined Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2014, 05:28:56 pm »
I don't know, but some people have said they felt it was a misunderstood entity and that they have compassion for it.  But like Tatja said, that just really shows their own misunderstanding.  I forget who came up with this analogy (I wish it was me, but it wasn't), but Apep is a lot like the ecthroi in the Madeline L'Engle books.  It X's things.  It is nothingness.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Tasedjebbastmut »
Daughter of Bast-Mut & Hekatawy Alexandros (AUS)
Beloved of Yinepu, Sekhmet, Set, Heru-wer, and Aset

Offline Tahai

  • Shemsu
  • Country: us
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2014, 05:33:03 pm »
Hi Abigail,

There are people who choose to view it as a 'misunderstood' diety, similar to Set.

There are people who like to do things just to be shocking.

There are people who like to look 'bad-ass'.

There are people who think they truly do want the end of everything.

*shrug*  Bunch of idiots, in my personal opinion.

As far as wrapping your head around what the uncreated is...have you ever watched 'The Neverending Story' movie or read the book?  The Nothing would be similar to the uncreated.  The uncreated 'wants' everything to return to the state it was in the primordial Nun.
TahaiBast
Daughter of Bast.  Beloved of Sobek-Ra, Djehuty, and Sekhmet-Hethert.

Self-care Sekhmet and Sobek-Ra Keeper

Feed the Ka Association (FKA)

Offline Devo

  • Remetj
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2015, 10:25:05 pm »
I'm not sure if this would be helpful for the OP, but KRT has discussed a/pep and modern practices, which may be helpful for understanding it, or understanding how Kemetics interpret it's role in their practice.
http://www.roundtable.kemeticrecon.com/maat-isfet/

-Devo
dA | FB | Tumblr | WP

Offline Neferkara

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2015, 05:35:35 am »
Em Hotep,

I see A-pep as a personified force, rather than an actual being, a lot like Ma'at being moral order. I see A-pep as literal nothingness, which is hard to think about since in our world, there is always something. I see Nun as the personified pool of the unknown, the space outside our world/ solar system. We know there is something but we are not sure of its nature.

I think A-pep will always have relevance. I think creation is like a pane of glass. A-pep wants to destroy the glass so it turns back into sand. The large cracks are fixed or maintained by the Netjeru, the small cracks are fixed or maintained by humans. By maintaining or fixing the spread of the small cracks, makes it easier to fix or maintain the larger ones. We work together to stop the glass from shattering.

Too much order causes oppression, too much chaos causes anarchy, we need to find stability between the two, making sure the scale doesn't tip too far in one direction so that it falls over and A-pep takes over.

Senebty

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2015, 08:18:31 am »
How can Apep be seen as a force alone? I know from the KO teachings that Ma'at is a codex of some sort AND a Netjeri.
So can Apep be a force and a monster at the same time? I read in some places that he's not a god, but some sort of huge demon that seeks do devour the sun.
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Neferkara

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: Does Apep have any modern relevance?
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2015, 11:10:25 am »
Em Hotep,

I don't believe in "demons" or "daemons". It may have being an Ancient Egyptian way of understanding, but I sure don't.

To me this mythology makes the most sense.

A-pep has always been, in the time before Zep Tepi when the Creator lay within Nun, either sleeping or a sleep like state, A-pep was there alongside, protecting the Creator from the unknown, then the Creator woke up or became aware and began creating spiritual and physical forms. A-pep no longer had purpose, the Creator no longer needed protection from the unknown. So hateful, jealous or angry for having nothing and being nothing, A-pep went against the Creator and went to undo what was done, so the Creator will return back to the ways of before.

I don't take the mythology as a literal hypothesis of how the universe began. Just because something is a concept or an idea doesn't make it any less divine or dangerous. Love is a strong and powerful emotion, that makes people do the most beautiful and hateful acts, it can cause bliss and grant endurance, but also physical pain and even death. Its source is divine, but it doesn't have actual form.

Senebty

 


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