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Author Topic: The problem with forced religion  (Read 1597 times)

Offline Mr awesome357

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
The problem with forced religion
« on: June 29, 2019, 09:27:40 am »
If you found a new religion that is more pure and right than another and makes you happy in life then why do people try to take that away. For example I prayed to Horus because i was at a point of depression so bad I was going to kill myself. But he answered and showed me a new religion
that brought me happiness and helped me escape from an awful environment. And my mom believes in this religion but my grandma does not. My grandmother wants to take my religion away, the only thing that makes me happy! Im happy with my beliefs and she calls it false and evil.

Have you had anyone try to dictate your belief to you?
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Offline Mr awesome357

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2019, 09:35:20 am »
please feel free to move this to an appropriate place
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Offline Tjemsy

  • W'ab Priest - Lay Clergy
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2019, 11:02:19 am »
I think that whether a religion is "more pure and right" than another is always going to be a matter of opinion. I'm glad Heru was able to help you and that you have found a good religion for you. I'm glad your mom is supportive, and I'm sorry your grandmother is not. There are a lot of people (largely Christians ime) who think our religion is false and evil. I'm sure my mother and sister would fall easily under that category. My dad seems to fall under "Well you're kind of stupid for thinking this could be real, but whatever." I worry at times about my Akhu, who are all Catholic as far back as I can trace them, with one I was close to in life even being a Catholic priest. I just kind of...hope for the best. I'm sure I could do divination or something to find out how they feel, but it'd probably break my heart if they were anti. So...I kind of don't want to know. :|

As for "why" people are this way...I'm not entirely sure. It's probably something defensive, like we can't possibly be right, or else their whole world will fall down, hence the hostile response. I tried positing that the Christian God is not the "one and the only" thing out there and that it was possible for multiple things to be true, and my dad was like "Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of religion? 'You can believe in this but you don't have to?'" Honestly, it just seems respectful to me.

tldr: -extended shrugging- I hope things get better for you and your grandma. Hugs and love. <3
Tjemsy - "Two Red Ones"

Sat Sekhmet her Set
Meryt Heru-wer, Bast, Wepwawet, Taweret, Nebthet,
 & Nefertem-Imhotep


Fedw Diviner | Tjemsy@kemet.org

Offline Mr awesome357

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2019, 03:35:12 pm »
I think people need to be more accepting to others beliefs if those beliefs make the believer themselves happy. Heru told me that it is happiness that we achieve through our beliefs that will lead us to our afterlife. A belief is free will and our men and women fought for us to have this freedom and it seems people want to take this away for some reason. As long as you do good and uphold truth and don't seek out harm on others your beliefs are yours to choose. Don't force your "version" of belief on me, let me find something to believe in that makes me happy and leads me to achieve a true and happy life.

What are others thoughts on this? I'd like to hear more people respond. Don't give in to fear. Get this off your chest and be passionate about it.
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Offline Lil Auset

  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2019, 04:19:17 pm »
I haven’t had anyone try to force me to believe in anything since I was about 19 yrs old. I have always been the type to let people know where I stood and I’ve been firm about it. Of course, my family wanted me to stay with the religion I was raised on, but I couldn’t.

My family still tries, but they stay respectful the same way I do them. I don’t expect everyone to be accepting of my religious choices. People nowadays can’t even respect a persons choice on who to love yet, so I don’t keep my expectations high. I only worry about if I accept me for me. People come and go. They accept and they don’t. That’s life 🤷🏾‍♀️

Just worry about how you feel and how your god feels. I didn’t come into this religious decision with anyone else in mind but ME. If no one around me accepts it, then OOOOH WEEEELLLLLLL!! I accept you. So do the others in this community  :D
Everyday is a new day to change ✊🏾

Offline Biwimuti

  • Shemsu
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2019, 05:03:52 pm »
Unfortunately, proselytism is an extremely common practice in many religious communities, especially Christianity. Many of those Christians don't even realize that their actions are hurting people; they've been told that anyone who isn't part of their specific religious sect is doomed to an eternity of suffering, and so they think that it's necessary to do anything they can to "help" us and "save" us from that fate, even when they're hurting us to do so. It's a necessary evil in their eyes, and I feel bad for them to be completely honest. It must be a hard life, caring more for what will happen to you when you're dead and rotting than what you're doing now, when you're alive and hurting others.

I've been a victim of proselytizing my entire life, having grown up in a very Catholic area in a very non-Catholic household. My friends and neighbors tried to convert me, my white Christian family tried to convert me, even some of my school teachers tried to convert me. It's painful and scary, especially since, as a Native person, I've seen what that sort of mindset can do to a person.

My experiences with Christianity are nothing compared to the experiences of the woman who raised me, my great grandma, who was forced into an American Indian Catholic boarding school as a child and later forced into a loveless and abusive marriage with a white man by a church she never wanted to be part of in the first place. It devastated our entire family, and I grew up seeing the trauma not only in my grandma, but also echoed in her siblings and children and grandchildren and great grandchildren.

Proselytism is dangerous. Don't believe anyone who tells you otherwise.

Senebty,
Biwi (Hawke)
Biwi
“My two mothers set a good example (for me).”

Child of Sekhmet-Hethert and Serqet-Aset.
Beloved of Khonsu, Set, and Wepwawet-Yinepu.

Offline Tjemsy

  • W'ab Priest - Lay Clergy
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2019, 05:14:10 pm »
My mother is really bad about the forcing religion on me thing. She recently told me that Jesus would cure my narcolepsy (I was just diagnosed) if I would just believe in him. This comes up in our conversations fairly regularly. Of course I'm adamant that I am not ever going to become Christian, but she seems to think that I'm going to eventually see the light.

I'm sure that she would say, in some roundabout way, that my narcolepsy came as a result of worshipping Netjer, since Netjer = The Devil and The Devil is where all bad things come from. Thankfully she doesn't know the details of my religion, just that it's something other than Christian. So we're not quite there yet.

I'm so sorry that happened to you, Biwi. : (
Tjemsy - "Two Red Ones"

Sat Sekhmet her Set
Meryt Heru-wer, Bast, Wepwawet, Taweret, Nebthet,
 & Nefertem-Imhotep


Fedw Diviner | Tjemsy@kemet.org

Offline Gleb

  • Remetj
  • Country: 00
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2019, 02:19:21 am »
Your religion is your choice alone. Nobody can really take it away from you. If you feel better believing in religion X, as long as it harms none - by all means do. What I suggest is to stand your ground and make people respect your choice, so you will be able to respect theirs in return.
Senebty,
Gleb

Offline Yinepuemsaes

  • Shemsu
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2019, 02:27:53 pm »
Whenever anyone tries to proselytize or convert me, I think of this article:

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/panmankey/2016/10/proselytizing-is-for-weak-gods/
Yinepuemsaes - "Yinepu is her protection"
Sat Yinepu
Meryt Bast

Offline Senneferet

  • Country: gb
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2019, 07:45:54 am »
My problems usually come from atheists or rather, anti-theists. They can get quite angry at any sort of religious person but paganism and polytheism always seems extra illogical to them. I never mention my religion to people so why anti-theists always need to bring religion into our conversations is beyond me.

I've had no judgement from Christians in my family, including my Church of England husband (he goes to church every Sunday, mens prayer group on a Wednesday, and Christian Union at work on a Tuesday, so he's quite devout).

It's very sad that your grandmother is so against your new found beliefs. If you are not hurting anyone and you are generally being a good person, why does it matter? 

Offline Dusk

  • Remetj
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2019, 12:02:47 am »
 I was raised in the christian faith. My coming out as a gay and my family learning about my following Yinepu went about as well as one would think. My dad said he didn't care about my attraction or my "imaginary friends". My mother says she can feel evil around me and my grandmother claims I'm an abomination that needs to be saved.  I was angry for...a really long time, Until recently, actually. Its taken a lot to get to where I am. I'm finally free of my abusive family. and I've found I'ts easier to just leave them be. "everyone has they're own path" is a mantra that comes up in situations such as these. If we truly wish to pursue our path and all our energy and the energy of our gods/spirits/guides,etc. walks with us, then I truly think we'll make it out of any adversity. Something like this can't be taken. Temples and altars can be destroyed, sure. The gods found us even in modern day though so, I know that people can try and fail to destroy what they fear, but it is futile. I give respect where it is due, and walk away when it is not. Being open about the gods still something I struggle with but, I'm learning, especially now that I'm here.
They/Them

Offline Gino Silveira

  • Remetj
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2019, 04:20:14 pm »
Yes, and with the imposition of a belief behind it is a worldview that may be diametrically opposed to yours. I live in a country with an overwhelming Christian majority, and there is a whole framework that I can not say is "morally Christian" but that it has a good effect of alienating and seeing with a certain hostility other religions, some shrugging as well, belief others accuse of impious, impure, you do not know the "Word" and so goes to the point that in some radical and extremist situations of destroying temples and physical and verbal aggression

Offline Tatuayinepu

  • Shemsu-Ankh
  • Country: us
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2019, 12:23:14 am »
Some of my family treated my work with Yinepu as a mental illness that I "needed help with", others were resentful that I stopped talking with them (partly due to the statement about my needing help but mostly because of old family lies surfacing around the same time), and thought that it was "because of your religion not allowing you to talk with your family".

In reality, I stopped talking with these family members because I got tired of hearing these things, they didn't even try to listen or to learn about my beliefs, and for once in my life I told them NO. No more selling my soul to fit in, no more being agreeable and no more lies.

This was before I found the House of Netjer. In the years since then, I've had a few conversations with one of them that has shown me nothing has changed on their end so I leave them alone.

How I choose to work with the divine, is my choice and my choice alone. It is not up to anyone, regardless of whether they are blood relatives or not. I'm not allowing anyone in my life that does not respect my rights in this area. Period.   

« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 12:31:15 am by Tatuayinepu »
Tatuayinepu "The one Yinepu sustains"

Child of Yinepu-Wepwawet and Hekatawy Alexandros I (AUS); Beloved of Sekhmet-Hethert, Heru Sa Aset, Set, and Heru wer

Sau Apprentice/Fedw diviner for Yinepu and Sed/Fundraising Team

Offline Nesiwepwawet

  • Shemsu
  • Country: ca
Re: The problem with forced religion
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2019, 08:26:43 pm »
I've always found forced religion to be a product of fear, for the 'major religions' that would be the fear of their friends and family going to a bad place if they don't practice and believe precisely as they themselves do.

On my journey through many religions through my life, I once had an amazing mentor: an Anglican priest with a bit of a flare for agnosticism :) Never had I met anyone like him. The most warm and welcoming fellow you will ever meet, and more open-minded than his title might lead you to believe. During one of our long discussions about philosophy and religion, he described to me his thoughts on faith / religion and what keeps him free of fear (the fear that leads to 'forced religion').

He told me he pictured God as an island, and all of human kind are in our little individual boats that we've crafted, trying to get to that island. Some people might get there faster, others might get there more slowly (definitely me) take the long way 'round and the scenic route, where others go directly from point a to point b without stopping. Some people, having reached the island, profess they've found the only good boat, or the only good sea-faring route, to get there, having landed and seeing no one else about. Others reach landfall alongside many boats, and they welcome each other, and help each other reach the shore. Still others may stay at sea, content to fish for their supper each day, sleep soundly under the stars with the lapping waves about them.

But while each person's individual journey was completely different, they were all 'correct', for that person, at that time, in that way.

He was very descriptive even more than that, like he had told the tale a hundred times, and probably he had. I admit I asked how he could be a Christian priest if he believed quite like he did, the question was only logical, but he only smiled at me and said simply wanted to share the joy of his own path with others and help lead people to the island through his own successful journey.

And since he had no fear of the other paths in life, he had no true reason to beat people over the head with religion. He taught from a place of love, and only love, and you could tell it through and through.

I had never met a man quite like him. But it shows what people can be like if they simply let go of things like fear, and the hate or other negativity that is born of fear. These negative things are what eventually lead to 'forced religion', and I try my best to think of how fearful people must be deep down when I see them trying to force their beliefs on others. I feel pain for them.

They believe they are saving others though, and they are genuine about that feeling. So I try my best to have compassion for them, even though I strongly disagree with the practice, particularly when it becomes violent.  :'(

Forced religion is a hard nut to crack. I feel all we can do is be supportive of those who need it the most, such as those who are victimized, and where possible (and only where possible), have the strength of character to forgive those who might not fully understand the damage they are doing to others.
Nesiwepwawet - "Belonging to Wepwawet"
sat Wepwawet-Yinepu
meryt Hethert-Sekhmet her Amun

 


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